Seduction of the independent female

Men sometimes ask how to initiate a Taken In Hand relationship with their girlfriend or wife. I am a woman over 40 and a feminist. I have a doctoral degree and own my own consulting firm. I am the sole breadwinner in my family and I have been married over 20 years.

Our relationship had long been in place and I was clearly more comfortable in any realm where I had control. Intimacy was a distant memory. Deep inside I wanted to be taken in hand and was terrified to admit that this superwoman, super mom wanted nothing more than to be submissive. How could I admit that at home I wanted to give up control? I wanted my husband to lead me. I wanted to feel like a woman again and not some efficient money-making machine. I was the one who finally proposed the exchange of power, and I will never regret it.

I have given the issue of how a man with a wife like me could initiate this concept, test the waters to see what happens, and slowly over the course of several months, assert himself into the role of head of the household. If approached slowly and with love, I believe that a woman will come around. If she doesn't, then certainly a more direct approach right off the bat would probably have backfired big time.

Of course there is risk to pushing, even gently. You could scare her further away. Generally speaking, in a long-term relationship, where love and commitment already exist and a hasty exit without discussion would be unlikely, I would say, move ever forward. Don't give up. Don't backslide. Don't be bullied into your old role. You are taming the shrew, and you must assume she wants to be tamed. Assert control and increase your charm in increments. If you are wrong, she will never give an inch, she will fight you all the way. After months of trying and making no progress, you may need to re-evaluate. You could then put your cards on the table and see what happens.

I am no expert but I believe this approach is worth a try. These are just one woman's suggestions to inspire you. You know your wife or girlfriend best. Use that knowledge to adapt these ideas for her as the individual she is. What would work in one case might be disastrous in another case.

General Rules

Occasionally call her your bride when referring to her in front of others (even if she objects: the term implies pride in her beauty as well as some possessiveness).

When at a restaurant, ask what she wants, and then when the waiter comes over, immediately order for her and then yourself.

Always hold her hand in public. Always! This is not optional. Do not let her pull her hand away. If she attempts to walk away, squeeze her hand and gently pull her back to your side. Lean over and whisper in her ear asking her why she needs to leave you. Make her tell you. Then smile, kiss her cheek, and let her hand go. If the excuse is nothing more than a way to get you to let go of her hand, tell her she can do that later and continue to hold her hand. She is unlikely to cause a scene. As she stands there livid, she realizes you literally have the upper hand. She doesn't want to create a scene in public, and you won't let go. She has no choice but to do as you say. Each time this happens, you show her your strength and power over her.

Anticipated response: “Don't ever do that again.”

Reply: “I just love having you near me.” Keep doing it. You may have to take her hand, because she will be unlikely to offer it. Once again, if you do this when others are present, she will hopefully feel too awkward, to refuse. If she pulls away, say quite loudly, “Now honey, don't be that way” and quickly take her hand. Don't let go. You have to be willing to be forceful in this regard even if it may cause others to stare. They will simply think it is a lover's quarrel when they see you are smiling and looking on her with love and she is pouting. You can't let what others think prevent you from proceeding. She may have a higher tolerance for making a scene than you do. Outlast her.

Always open car doors for her.

Anticipated response: “You don't need to do that. I don't like it.”

Reply: “Oh, but I do.” Smile, end of conversation.

Anticipated response: She rushes to the car door before you and opens it herself.

Reply: Open the car door again. Unlock her seat belt. Readjust it so that it fits her snugly making sure to give her breasts a stroke with the back of your knuckles as you do so. Then kiss her on the cheek and say, “Just want you safe, my love.” This is much more intrusive and intimate than the door being opened, so may result in her allowing you to open the car door in the future to avoid this. Other women watching will find it tender and romantic.

Whenever your efforts to initiate intercourse are rejected, get dressed and leave the house for at least a couple of hours. If she asks where you are going, just respond almost as if you are excited about it, “Out for a drive. You get some sleep. Sweet dreams.” Kiss her on the forehead before you go. The goal is to give her room to doubt her hold on you or at least on your lovemaking. Could you be seeing someone who won't deny you? Is she at risk of losing you? Simply plant this seed by allowing for the possibility in her mind. At some point, you might even stay out all night. (You can sleep in your office). Then if she questions you, simply state, “You were so tired; I didn't think you'd even notice I was gone. I couldn't sleep so I went to the office to catch up on some work.” This should be true by the way. A nervous woman is more likely to take risks in opening herself up to intimacy and abandoning some control.

Never give in to temper tantrums. When she gets bitchy, ignore her completely. If she has PMS, however, pour her a glass of water, hand her two Midol PMS pills, and say, “I love you even when you're all PMSy.” Then ask her if she'd like some cuddle time. Honor her request.

Initial Steps: No Positive Response Needed from Her

Note left in wallet, “You drive me wild.”

Tell her to close her eyes while you tell her a dream you ‘had’ about her that was sexy and sweet.

If she is in her later 30s to early 50s, tease her often about hitting her sexual peek. Tell her it is obvious that she is hitting it because men can sense it. If you leave town, tell her you may have to get her a chastity belt because you don't want any other men sniffing around while you're gone. [Your assumption that other men would and should be attracted to her will be very flattering, even if she does not appear flattered.]

When you catch her about to wake up, position yourself so that it is obvious that you were admiring her body while she slept. Then when she notices, kiss her on the lips and hip and say: “Good Morning you unbelievably sexy woman, you.”

When you are in public and get separated talking to different people, make sure she catches you looking at her with interest and a smile as if you can't stop thinking about her. Periodically cross the room and as you put you arm around her waist, slide it up so that your hand is under her arm and your fingers are actually along the side of her breast for a moment. Not enough for anyone to notice, but enough for her to realize you just touched her breast in public. Then whisper in her ear before you walk away again, “You look so sexy in that dress.”

Develop the fine art of winking. Wink at her from across the room. Wink at her across the table during a meal out. The wink is an unspoken intimacy and it is very flattering to the recipient. Let other women see you wink at her. They will tell her how lucky she is to have a husband who is so attentive, always holding her hand, opening her car door, putting his arm around her, calling her his bride, etc. The more that others tell her she is lucky, the more she will have to think about the fact that the other husbands don't seem to do this for their wives.

Anything you can do to make her blush, even if it is in front of strangers (not people she knows.) At the mall, at a restaurant, etc., you can say to the clerk or server, this is my bride of xx years, isn't she absolutely beautiful?” They will of course say yes. Start out by doing this with older women who will find you charming. Then try it with a male, but change the question to, “Aren't I a lucky man.” As a member of the brotherhood of men, unless he still has pimples, he will say, “Yes sir, you certainly are.” You have now elicited a compliment from an unknown male and she has heard it. Is he just saying that to be polite, or does he think it for real? What a total rush for your wife. Even if she protests, your goal has been accomplished, and you can say, “I can't help myself.” It may have been a long time since she thought of herself as a prize.

Make a reservation at a charming bed and breakfast within a short driving distance. On a Saturday afternoon, when you know your calendars are clear, tell her you need her to accompany you on a commonplace errand. Have a bag packed for her in the car trunk. No pyjamas necessary, you simply forgot to pack them. (A toothbrush, cosmetics, medication, change of clothes.) Then drive her to the hotel and check in. Each time she asks, tell her it is a surprise. When you arrive, tell her she needed a mini vacation. Then stroll along a small town and browse antique shops, or something she would enjoy that you would ordinarily hate doing. Be a really good sport about it. Have reservations someplace quiet and romantic for dinner. When you get in bed, tell her how much you love her and you enjoyed spending the day with her. You know how tired she is, so if she wakes up in the night and wants you to make love to her, simply kiss you awake. Whether or not there is intimacy this night is her call. This is her vacation. Your goal is to show her that it is not just about sex, but also about enjoying time together.

Intermediate Stage: Playing with Fire

When watching TV, sit next to her on the couch. As soon as she says she's tired and turning in, say, “Come kiss me good night after you brush your teeth.” This gives her time to brush her teeth, wash her face, put on her pyjamas, etc. Then when she comes back out, pick her up and carry her to bed. If she doesn't come kiss you goodnight, go into the bedroom.

Once she is in bed, tuck the covers all around her. Kiss her gently on the forehead. Say, “I love you. Sweet dreams my darling.” Then leave her alone. While she sleeps, take a permanent marker and write your name just above her pubic area. When she throws a fit in the morning, feign innocence: “What a sweet thing for you to do. Honey, that must be just about the nicest gifts any man could ever receive. You are full of surprises.” Then kiss her. Do not respond to questions. Do not respond to anger.

Every woman has to bend over to pick up newspapers, junk on the floor, toys, things she dropped. Regardless of whether it is true or not, simply for the sake of this exercise, she must believe that you honestly assume that each time you catch her doing this she is trying to sexually entice you. When you catch her bending over, say: “You know that drives me crazy when you bend over like that. In fact, I suspect you do it on purpose just for that reason.”

Anticipated response: “I do not.”

Reply: “You can't fool me, you little tease.”

The next time you catch her in the position, say, “I knew it. There you go again. Driving me crazy bending over like that. Next time you do that, I'm going to assume it's an invitation.”

Anticipated response: “It is not.”

Reply: “Then you best not be bending over around me anymore.”

Then the next time you see her bending over, assume it is an invitation. Make a sexual sound like a growl, slap her on the rear, pick her up and carry her to the bedroom.

Anticipated response: “Stop it. Let me go right now.”

Reply: “Not until you apologize.”

Anticipated response: “For what?”

Reply: “For taunting me with your sweet ass again. Repeat after me, ‘I'm sorry for tempting you with my sweet ass again.’” Don't let her up until she says it. Then say, “Apology accepted, but only this once.”

Then the next time, take it one step further in bed. Don't let her up until she let's you kiss her breasts, etc. Each time it goes a bit further. This should be very playful in your tone.

Situate yourself spread eagle behind her on the floor or on the bed, and wrap your legs around hers and your arms around her as well. “I want you to rest your head back on me and describe a sexual fantasy or make believe story.”

Anticipated response: “I don't have any.” Or “Absolutely not. Let me go.”

Reply: Wrap your legs and arms around tighter and don't let go. “You don't leave until you tell me a sexy story. You have a great imagination. No excuses.”

Anticipated response: Silence or “No.”

Reply: “If you had to write a sexy romance novel would the theme be: pirate/captive, patient/doctor, school girl/professor? Pick one. Now tell me what is your lovely heroine's name? [Insert her name?] How did she meet her rogue, [insert your name]? Does she resist him initially? How does he win her over? Does he do this?” Start touching her breasts. If there is no resistance, continue the questioning, “What about this?” Touch her elsewhere; continue the pattern.

Anticipated response: Stop It.

Reply: Then tell me the story.

Anticipated response: She tells one and really tries.

Reply: “Why you little vixen you! I can't believe you think of naughty things like that.” Then let her go.

Anticipated response: She tells one but makes no effort, and willfully makes it boring or ends poorly, like the heroine slaps the rogue and leaves the country never to be seen again.

Reply: “We need to work on your story telling skills. We'll practice again soon. I'll give you an example. Make her the lovely innocent and you the rogue. She is kidnapped by you and taken from her father because he was enraptured by her beauty. He is a bit rough around the edges, but never hurts her. Nevertheless, he feels free to have his way with her whenever he wishes, and will only pull her back into the bed, and spank her bottom, if she attempts to get away. Otherwise he is very gentle. Over time she realizes that he loves her. But she resists enjoying his touch, she tries to hide the redness in her face when she sees him staring at her bare body. Then he suddenly disappears without a word, leaving her stranded in his home/boat/castle with no clothes, no way out, but plenty of food. For a week she waits, alone, feeling abandoned, realizing that she actually misses him, even aches for his touch. Then he returns carrying a wardrobe filled with beautiful dresses and jewelry he has chosen just for her. She falls into his arms and he carries her to the bed, and they live happily ever after.

[Note: As ridiculous as this sounds, there must be some reason millions of women read this story line over and over again in romance novels. This is exactly what you are trying to accomplish.]

When you finish the story, you say, “So the rogue, while not perfect, treasures his sweet little captive. And with lots of patience and lots of love, he finally awakened in her the desire she had long suppressed.” [Meaning, she does not lack passion or a sex drive. She is simply suppressing it. And your evil plot is to unlock the box.]

While she is sitting on the couch or in a chair, walk up from behind her, encircle your hand around a large amount of hair and hold it. Then tell her you are going to brush her hair.

Anticipated response: “Stop it.”

Reply: If she attempts to move away, hang on to the hair that you had initially placed in your hand. As long as it is a handful of hair and not a few strands, it shouldn't hurt her, but it will keep her in the seat. “Oh no you don't. I've wanted to do this a long time, and you're going to sit there while I enjoy myself. Go ahead and watch your TV show and don't mind me.” Then when finished, lift her hair and kiss her on the back of the neck, and whisper, “Now that wasn't so bad, was it.”

Anticipated response: “Yes it was.”

Reply: “Then I obviously need more practice.”

If she has a ratty t-shirt or something she wears to bed that you hate, throw it away. When she questions if you know where it is, play dumb. If she has no sleepwear that satisfies you, one day when she is out, take all of the pajamas out of her closet and hide them in a box in the garage. When she notices, tell her that you were tired of her wearing clothes to bed that hid her beautiful body, so she can sleep nude or she is free to purchase from among the items you have selected for her online. Then show her what you have chosen for her from VictoriaSecret.com or similar site. You can place it in a cart so she can review the items and choose with you.

Anticipated response: That night she shows up for bed in another baggy T-shirt. Smile at her wryly and wait until she goes to sleep. Then with a flashlight so you can see what you are doing, carefully cut the t-shirt from top to bottom (front or back – it doesn't matter). When she wakes up, she'll get the idea. Her options were nude or your choice. Repeat this until she breaks down and chooses to order from your selection.

While at dinner at a restaurant, where she can't easily get away, describe for her an erotic dream that includes spanking for a real reason, followed by intense love and loyalty. Make the example one where she had risked her safety (no seat belt, driving while drinking, etc.) Then tell her it feels good to have a woman you can not only dream about but you can share your dreams with.

At this stage, whenever she gets a bit surly or bossy, give her a playful swat (not a caress) on the bottom, and say, “Careful, you don't want a real spanking, or do you?” This should be repeated many times. Whenever she objects, tell her that she brought it on herself by doing whatever it was she wasn't suppose to do.

Advanced Stage: Intimacy

When she is out of the house, remove locks from all bedroom doors so she can't lock you out or find a place to sleep where she can keep you at bay. It is fine to leave locks on the bathrooms doors. If she chooses to sleep in the bathroom all night, she probably will only pull that stunt once.

Each time she seems to be resistant to intimacy, you must give a show of strength and assert your will. Grab her arms, and while kissing her forcefully, move her arms behind her back, and hold them there. This should in no way hurt her, but is intended to make clear that with your superior strength, you could easily force her if you chose to do so. Then after a long hard kiss. Look into her eyes, and let her go, and walk away saying absolutely nothing. Ignore anything she may say that is negative and walk away, responding only with a triumphant smile. You are calm. She is flustered or angry. You have won that round.

Plan a date night and that morning before going to work, set out the outfit you want her to wear. Tell her to have it on when it is time to go out. because that particular outfit emphasizes her beautiful (breasts, legs, rear end, or such). Don't ask her. Tell her.

Anticipated response: She isn't dressed in the outfit you chose.

Reply: “You're not dressed. Shall you go change into the outfit I chose for you or would you prefer that I dress you?”

Anticipated response: She objects and refuses.

Reply: Repeat your statement looking directly into her eyes without anger but with authority in your voice, “Will you go change into the outfit I chose or would you prefer that I dress you?”

Anticipated response: She still refuses.

Reply: If she really wanted to go on the date, tell her you are disappointed she doesn't want to go and proceed to fix a sandwich from the fridge. If she won't be disappointed by your canceling the date, then tell her that you assume her refusal to change herself, means she wants you to dress her. Then reach to begin undressing her.

Anticipated response: She literally dodges you.

Reply: Do not chase her or force it. Stay in place and remain calm. Stare at her then tell her that her decision will have consequences. Refuse to explain further. If she didn't really want to go, take her out anyway. If she now refuses to go, or really wanted to go, don't take her. The next time she is out of the house, remove all of her clothing and place it in a closet to which you have installed a lock and have the only key. Remember to pull any of her dirty clothes out of the laundry room too. When she realizes she has no clothes, explain that from now on, you will be picking her clothes every day since she seems unable to compromise with a simple request for a date night. Then she only gets clothes that day if she must go to work or attend a critical meeting. When she agrees to wear what you like for date nights, give her back only the clothes that you like and those that she must wear for work.

At some point when you are taking her somewhere that she really wants to go, and where you are very unlikely to run into anyone either of you know, ask her to wear a short sleeved shirt with fabric that stretches. When she comes out ready to go, walk up to her and tell her that there is one more thing you need to do first, then through her shirt, unhook her bra. Reach up one sleeve and pull down the strap below her elbow and over her hand. Then proceed with the other strap. Then if her shirt is untucked, reach up under her shirt and pull the bra off removing it from under her shirt. If the shirt is tucked in, reach down the front of her shirt and pull the bra out of one sleeve, then the other. Then lay the bra to the side and tell her that now you're ready to go out with me. Keep one hand on her lower back to keep her from backing away from you.

Anticipated response: “What do you think you are doing? Stop. I can't go out without a bra on!”

Reply: “Okay then, we won't go.”

Anticipated response: “Fine then, I'll go without you.”

Reply: “I don't think so.” Hold up both sets of car keys. Without the keys, she has to choose whether to go braless or not go at all.

When you hear her in the shower, wait until you believe she is just about done, then step into the shower with her.

Anticipated response: She stays.

Reply: Kiss her and touch her breasts; you know the rest. Tell her she looks unbelievably sexy when she is wet. If there is any intimacy permitted at all, after the shower, you get a towel for her and start to hand it to her. Then you say, “Wait a minute. Not so fast.” Then you dry her off. First wrap the towel around her and kiss her while the towel soaks up most of the moisture and then pat dry her entire body paying close attention to her pubic area and breasts and bottom. Finish by saying, “All done, would you like me to add some lotion?” Even if she says no, as you walk away, say, “Well then, anytime I can be of assistance, just let me know. I'm always happy to help.”

Anticipated response: The second you get in the shower, she bolts out of the shower.

Reply: Snicker loudly as if mocking her modesty.

Rent and watch really romantic movies in the dark together. During the movie, wait on her. Ger her water, a bowl of grapes, etc. Hand her tissues if she cries and tell her you love that she has such a romantic heart. Give her a foot massage while she watches the movie. During the movie, make it obvious you are watching her as much as you are watching the movie. After the movie, tell her you'll clean up while she gets ready for bed. When you get in bed, kiss her neck, ears, lips. Whisper to her that you love her. Then make love to her.

Anticipated response: Any word that comes out of her mouth should be met with your index finger over her lips and a soft “Shhhhhhh. I'm making love to my lovely wife tonight so don't interrupt me.”

At some point when she has violated your instructions after having been cautioned before that there would be consequences next time, take her hand. Look her in the eyes. Tell her, “I told you there would be consequences.” Pull her over your knee, and slap her on the bottom 2 or 3 times. Announce that this was just a small demonstration of what happens when she disobeys. Help her stand up, and keep a firm hold on her. Look her in the eyes, and tell her, “I love you. You are the most precious thing in the world to me and so is our relationship. I have waited far too long to take you in hand. Things will be different around here. Make no mistake. I will tan your backside if you don't start showing me some respect around here. Are we clear?”

Truthful Scout

Take the Taken In Hand Tour


Have you seen the following articles?
What Taken In Hand is, and what it is not
Do you have a commanding presence?
Secretary: what did you think of this film?
In praise of Fascinating Womanhood
The exquisite pleasure of childlikeness in a woman
Dealing with a man who doesn't do as he's told
How it felt to be taken in hand for the very first time
Each to his own
The impossibility of installing a spine in a pansy
Actions speak louder than words
Is there consent?

This stuff might work for some people

Or it might not. A lot of it would drive me up the wall. Having someone hold your hand when you don't want them to might be very irritating for some women. I knew a couple years ago who held hands all the time when they were out. I used to look at them rather wistfully, since it was at a time when my husband and I were rowing all the time, and I used to think how romantic it was. Ten years ago they got divorced.

And then there's that car door thing again! Am I the only woman on this website who really doesn't want car doors opened for her, and who would actually find this extremely irritating? My husband does not have a high opinion of my technical abilities, but even he knows I can open a car door for myself (I can even do up my own seat belt). I know what would happen if he tried doing this, he'd start calling me 'Hyacinth' and I'd start giggling and both of us would break up.

And if he started asking total strangers in public places if they thought I was beautiful or something I'd drop dead with embarrassment and I would never EVER go out anywhere in public with him again, ever.

I don't normally wear anything in bed when my husband's home, because it gets too hot with clothes on if he's in the bed as well. But I certainly would not care for it if I was wearing something and he started cutting it up, nor if he wrote on me with marker pens or something.

And spanking a woman is a very dangerous thing to do unless you know for sure that she wants you to do it, that is not something I would recommend at all.

Watching films together is nice, though neither of us cares much for romances, but I certainly wouldn't want a foot massage, I'm not a foot person, but if he wanted to massage other bits of me that would be all right.

If a woman is feeling sufficiently submissive to dress the way her husband wants her to, that's very nice, but it's not something you can force on her. Locking all her clothes away would probably just enrage her, as it would me. (See this article for further comments on the ideas suggested.)

I would be rather cautious about following any of this advice, a lot of what this person suggests would just piss me off, and it's possible other women could be similarly affected. You need to think about what your partner wants as well as what you want. And I really, really would not advise spanking her unless you know she's likely to respond favourably, or you could find yourself in big trouble. A lot of women do not want this sort of thing at all. You don't need an instruction manual to tell you how to have a relationship, you need to find out for yourselves what works for you. A lot of this article just looks like bullying to me.

Ingenious!

I think this plan has great merit. For one thing it gives a man an excellent way to test the waters as gradually as he likes without making a fool of himself or doing anything outrageous right off the bat. The point seems to be to sieze control by increments and I like the way cooperation in being dominated is well-linked with gestures most women would find romantic. (A spoon full of sugar helps the medicine go down and all that.)

Also, when you approach a woman commandingly it simply has the effect of making it easier for her to cooperate than for her to put up a fuss. In taking the initiative you help her to relax. You give her a chance to discover what submission feels like. You remove the need for her having to pass judgement then and there. When a man is too tentative he leaves the ball in the woman's court. She may respond badly out of embarassment, pride or confusion even though she does, in fact, harbor submissive desires. The article gives men a general feel for the most useful attitude to adopt with a woman whom they are trying to take in hand. I think that is important information. Many men don't quite "get" why women respond sexually and emotionally to a bit of firmness. It is the combination of kindness and confident insistence that is so attractively masculine. It makes us feel safe, secure, valued and loved. And yet it must be hard for men to behave commandingly while feeling that they need to test the waters quite tentatively. I sympathize with their plight and think the author of this article is giving them good advice. I think that the beauty of this approach is that it is likely to work well with different types of women. Of course, some women will hate the whole thing I suppose. But the man would be able to find that out too without causing a rift in the relationship.

There is a reason that the romance novel heroes are all alike, particularly in how they approach their ladies. Most women do secretly adore the type or they wouldn't be such sterotypes now, would they?

This is not for everyone

I think that parts of the above plan could be wonderful and romantic for a couple who have already decided that they want a taken in hand relationship, but it would be a disastrous way to treat a woman who has never shown any previous interest in a taken in hand relationship: it's possible that she'll ecstatically collapse in your arms, but it's also possible that she'll divorce you. Also, as Louise pointed out, there are degrees of submission, and some of the tactics suggested in this article would test the limits of even the most dedicatedly submissive woman. Many women would like to have their hair brushed, but not many, submissive or not, will respond favourably to having all her clothes confiscated.

Definitely use with caution

As Trusted Scout (and everyone else so far!) says, her ideas shold be modified to suit the individuals concerned.

For myself, a foot massage would result in nasty bruises - I get into a bit of flap if my feet are touched.

And had my husband tried going out for a couple of hours (or all night) if I wasn't in the mood for sex before he became head of the household then I doubt we'd be at this stage now. Putting those sort of doubts in my mind would destroy a lot of trust I have in him, and without trust, there's problems in any relationship. Quite frankly - if he wanted to play those sort of games, then I wouldn't consider him a strong or dominant man - just a rather despicable one.

--

"There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Hamlet, somewhere.

I'd like to choose my own clothing

Some of the ideas in this article are great. In fact, my husband has done a few of these naturally ever since I've known him. However, a couple of the ideas are very iffy. I have to agree with others on the clothing issue. I would be extremely upset to find all my clothes gone! I want to be taken in hand, but I'd like to choose my own clothing. Sure, I'd like to consider clothing that my husband would like. But I don't want to be told how to dress and I need to be comfortable in my clothing. That kind of control would be too much for me.

Seduction into male dominance

Wow, there certainly are a lot of creative ideas in this article; and the author deserves a lot of credit for putting them together into such a comprehensive plan of attack. But I'll have to agree that these tactics would not work well for all women. For some women, this approach would be just right; but others it might drive to utter frustration. My own personal response is that such an approach would be much too gentle for my own tastes - and also much too manipulative. I would resent a man for assuming that he could manipulate me, whereas I would welcome his ability to coerce me physically.

I'd much rather that a man 'take me in hand' by wrestling me down and overpowering me; and thus demonstrating in a very direct and physical way just who's the boss. But I've long known that I'm sexually submissive, and only more recently came to realize that I want a man who can assume a dominant role in the relationship, not just the bedroom. So the way a man could introduce that to me would be to start in the bedroom, by exerting direct physical control and dominance during sex; and then slowly extend that control from the bed to the bedroom, then to the rest of the home, then finally to our entire romantic relationship no matter where we are.

Some of the specific suggestions in the article I can relate to - such as the man opening the car door for me, and other doors as well. For me, this just goes naturally with the man being bigger and stronger, and also with him being protective of his woman. But it would drive me nuts if he insisted on holding hands all the time. I'm actually not real big on holding hands at all; but one idea I saw that I liked was for a dominant man to hold his woman firmly by the wrist in public, instead of by the hand. That seems to me to better emphasize his control; but I still would not want my arm captivated all the time. What I do like is a little bit of playful arm-wrestling in public; like when we're sitting in a restaurant booth. Arm wrestling is an easy, sexy way for a man to gain the upper hand - quite literally. (But I would only want to do this in diners, and not embarrass ourselves in fancy restaurants.) Few things turn me on more than seeing how easily a strong man can pin down both of my arms with just one of his.

I'll confess that I'm a big fan of wearing old T-shirts to bed; I wouldn't mind wearing something more feminine if it was made out of soft cotton flannel, but I hate trying to get to sleep in nylon or other synthetic fabrics with scratchy lace. I'm sure that's an area where some compromise would be easy to reach if we just talked about it. But if I woke up to find that one of my favorite old T-shirts had been destroyed with a pair of scissors, then I'd be looking for a little scissor retribution of my own. (Snip, snip...)

As for the man showering me with compliments as to my beauty and sexiness and desirability, and trying to get other people to agree with him...? Er, no thanks. I'm not really into trying to be sexy, or dress sexy, or wanting lots of men would look at me with lust. I really just need one man to look at me that way; and I'd rather that he desire me for my mind and my soul and my personality and my submissive feminine nature - not just for my body. Besides, I've always thought that men made much better sex objects than women. (And if you look at animals in nature, it's always the males who are the pretty ones with the brightly colored tail feathers, strutting their stuff for hordes of admiring females.)

As for him giving me foot massages - NO thanks, never, not in any circumstances at all, thankyouverymuch. If my man ever even offered to give me a foot massage, that would give me serious doubts about whether or not he's truly a dominant man. On the other hand, I would just love to give him a foot massage, every single night if he didn't mind. I've always had a strong attraction to every aspect of the masculine body, including men's feet. (Provided they're attractive and not gnarly.) Few things could push me into submissive feminine bliss more than kneeling at a man's feet and giving him a foot massage; especially after he has forced me to kneel.

One thing I really liked about this article is that the author makes it clear that the man's dominance does not depend on him being the 'breadwinner' - that the wife can be the one with the power career, and still come home to a dominant, loving husband. Anyway, it's always interesting to see the diverse range of ideas here.

- Dee

Different views of what is acceptable

I have to disagree with some on a couple of points. I have no problem whatsoever with a man opening car doors. I also have no problem with holding hands or with a man giving me a foot massage. In fact, I love that!

What I do have a problem with is the destroying or throwing out of my clothes, for one. That would really upset me. The other thing is him leaving at night, and possibly overnight. That is extremely uncalled for. It is selfish and inconsiderate. And if continued, grounds for an end to the relationship, in my opinion!

We all want different things

Aiden said:

A woman telling a man how to be dominant? Lol. Such a thing is ludicrous. Not because of the author's gender. But because simply, dominance cannot be taught.

It was my impression that Truthful Scout was not trying to teach a man how to be dominant, but rather providing ideas by which a man who's already dominant might bring a woman to enjoy and appreciate his dominance. Her ideas might work well for some women, and not well at all for other women. The answer to the age-old question of "What do women want?" is obvious: We all want different things.

As for the idea put forward in the comment above, that a woman chooses to give submission. This is simply wrong. When a woman truly experiences male dominance, and so for the first time, truly experiences submission, she is devoured. There is no control.

This is yet another way in which women differ. Personally, I just love the idea of feeling so utterly dominated by a strong man (in a sexual relationship only, mind you) that I have no choice but to submit. As to whether the reality of that would measure up to my fantasy ideals, that's harder to know. But for me the appeal of "consensual non-consent" or "blanket consent" is that once I've chosen to submit to this man, then he really can do whatever he wants with me. (And since we've already proved compatible, this will probably be very much what I want him to do with me.) If I felt it was just a game that I could stop at any time, then I would not feel truly dominated.

But I can see how the issue of consent could get tricky there, and I would certainly not want to feel trapped in an unhappy relationship. Maybe the point is this: if a dominant man can keep a woman feeling loved and deeply fulfilled in her submission to him, then it will seem to both of them that she really has no choice but to submit to his dominance. But if he does become abusive or neglectful, then I imagine she'll discover that she can regain her power of choice with astonishing rapidity. ;-)

One other thing I wanted to respond to regarding the original article, and this is an important safety point: This idea that the man could sneak up on the woman while she's sleeping and use a pair of scissors to cut off her sleeping garments sounds downright dangerous when you think about it. Because there's some chance that she might wake up during this, and then bolt quickly into an upright sitting position. And if he happens to be holding a sharp pair of scissors in the region of her abdomen or chest, she could end up getting badly stabbed. So please, please don't anyone try and pull the scissors trick on somebody while they're sleeping! Or if you do, make sure that you use a small pair of child's safety scissors - the kind with the blunt rounded ends - and not the pointy kind that could stab somebody. We always need to think of safety first.

- Dee

Dominance can't be taught

Desire, safety, abandonment, laughter, tenderness, vulnerability, hunger...love. All of these words and more, can be used in conjunction with submission. Because they are a part of it.
Yet if someone were to say that they could simply turn these emotions on and off, they would be labelled a fool. Certainly, the emotions I just gave, I do not control. Rather, they are drawn from me, or not, by the soul of a woman.
But still there are some women, who need to say they "choose" to give submission. Something which always presents itself, when there is not the reassurance there, that they are held in safety. And that is more than understandable.
As for what I agree with in the article, well, holding open doors and such.
Dominance can't be taught. It is instinctual in its unconscious application.

Aiden

"Maybe the point is this: if

Maybe the point is this: if a dominant man can keep a woman feeling loved and deeply fulfilled in her submission to him, then it will seem to both of them that she really has no choice but to submit to his dominance. But if he does become abusive or neglectful, then I imagine she'll discover that she can regain her power of choice with astonishing rapidity. ;-)

The first is submission. The second, that is subjugation. In submission a woman obeys, for she knows, both, the reasons behind her man's command, and too, that in her submission, she is enriched.

For a woman in such a relationship. A discipline spanking for transgression of what her man has commanded of her, is not the true punishment. That comes in the feeling of having failed him, herself, and their relationship. The spanking which follows serves as a means by which this pain may be released, and she be brought back fully to him.

Aiden

Manipulative

I was so put off by this article that I could not even finish reading it. It is all about pretending to be dominant. Its advice reminded me of the book The Surrendered Wife which I found manipulative and disturbing in just the same way.

The specific issues of opening car doors, dictating the woman's clothing choices, etc. were not relevant to me. (It is up to my husband to decide his involvement is such areas as he sees fit.) On the other hand, I was deeply disturbed by the phoniness and dishonesty that seemed to underly so much of the advice. In the part I read, I saw several admonitions to pretend to think or feel things in order to create the "correct" response from the woman. My husband definitely has the right to expect certain responses from me, but he does not pretend or lie in order to elicit them.

When my husband is romantic or forceful or whatever, he is doing it because that is who he is, not to manipulate me into a desired response. I think this basic honesty is tied in with Dee's comments concerning integrity in another thread. Like her, I understand taken in hand relationships as grounded in integrity.

J

The point being...

Aiden said:

"A discipline spanking for transgression of what her man has commanded of her, is not the true punishment. That comes in the feeling of having failed him, herself, and their relationship. The spanking which follows serves as a means by which this pain may be released, and she be brought back fully to him."

Well, I'm sure that works for many couples. I just don't really relate much, personally, to all the stuff about "discipline" and "transgression" and "punishment" and "failure." That sounds like I've granted him the right to decide what's ethical for me; but no, that is something that's up to my conscience alone. If I'm going to obey a man, it's not because he's 'wiser' and his rules are 'right' and it would be a 'transgression' or a 'failure' for me to disobey, and I should feel guilty or 'ashamed' or whatever. That sort of arrangement sounds to me more like a parent and child, not a husband and wife; where it's the parent's role to provide guidance, say what's right and wrong, etc.

No, I'm more likely to obey the man just because he's a lot bigger and stronger than I am, and he can easily cause me some unwelcome pain if I don't. No sense of shame or guilt or 'failure' is needed; because raw, simple fear provides all the motivation that I need. It's not that I've done 'wrong' if I disobey him - it's just that I might be in some frightful pain if I do that. (And frankly, I'm not even all that big on pain; it's really my instinctive gut fear of the man's strength that would effectively bring out my submission and allow him to control me, rather than pain per se. Which is why I think that tactics of intimidation and overpowering can work even better than stuff like spankings; at least in my case.)

I can certainly relate to the cathartic effects of spanking or other pain; but for me the catharsis would be more about the release of fear (or sometimes anger or sadness) than about the release of shame or 'failure.' This is probably just one of those areas where people have innate emotional differences. Sadness, fear, anger and despair are emotions I'm quite intimately familiar with; whereas I am not easily driven to needing approval, guilt, shame, painful embarrassment, sense of failure, fear of being unloved, etc.

(I once had a dominant guy try something on me that just perplexed and amused me at the time. Years later when I was reading up on BDSM I realized that it was probably intended as some sort of humiliation play. I don't think he got quite the reaction from me that he had been looking for.) But I imagine that for submissive women who are prone to any sorts of negative emotions, spanking or whipping could well be very cathartic. For me, wrestling or sparring with a much stronger man can achieve that just as well. (And hopefully with less actual pain.)

- Dee

gently, gently!

With a new woman, I have found it best to just handle her a lot. Stroke her, tell her she is beautiful, keep stroking her, bath her, massage her.

This develops a pattern in her brain, makes her bonded to you. This is very similar to how you should handle a new pet puppy. Bonding occurs with continual touching, stroking, holding intimately.

Gradually introduce the control ... spank her gently at first for some minor misdemeanour, and explain why you have spanked her. Soon she will will want you to "guide "/"lead" her by more and more severe spanking. Eventually, she will admit to "naughty" behaviour in anticipation of you correcting her with a more stylised spanking.

Try it. It works!

Life is short and wide.

A pet puppy?

You'd better watch out, puppies can bite! One day some woman may respond to you by taking your hand off.

puppies bite!

Yes, it is true, and so will a woman if pushed to far too soon! Gently, gently!
women do respond to being handled. Don't tell me you would not like your man to stroke you, bath you and sooth you.

Stroking and soothing

Well yes, I quite like being stroked and soothed under certain circumstances, so does my husband. I'm not actually terribly keen on being bathed, because I like to read in the bath, which is very difficult to do if someone is bathing you. It is quite nice occasionally though.

What I am a bit doubtful about is the idea of stroking and soothing as a prelude to getting them to like being spanked. I've always assumed that this was something you either liked or you didn't, whether it is possible to get someone to like it by stroking and soothing them first I wound think is a bit doubtful, unless the desire was there to start with.

Frankly though, I don't much care for being compared to a dog, having a man tell me I'm like a puppy would not be likely to endear him to me!

Poppycock!

There's very little here that I'd go along with. If my man tried any of that, I'd show him the door. Why the hell should he want/need to take control anyway? Shouldn't a couple be equals? Any man who'd be happy doing this lot would have to be a control freak! Hold my hand when I don't want him to? Who the hell would he think he was? Remove my clothes? Good God! I'm shocked anybody could even suggest it! As far as I'm concerned, this article is full of very dangerous advice.

sad

This is female fantasy.... I feel sorry for this woman. Based on what's she's said about herself this is coming from years of pain from "wearing the pants" in the family.

D/s relationship: I make the agreement with my woman that she has to do whatever I want, and that's the "end of the conversation". None of this gay-ass, antiquated bullshit about opening doors and talking to her in sweet tones. Blah, blah blah. If I feel like being sweet to her, I will. If I feel like being rude I will.

What gives a woman power in any d/s relationship is a) she gets pleasure out of being led and b) she has ultimate veto power called the LAW to call it off whenever she wants (the law is on her side). Submissive men in a d/s relationship are relieved of the pressure of being the boss.

CK

To CK

You sound to me like a quite remarkably selfish man. Does your 'woman' really get satisfaction from being treated as a doormat and never having her own feelings or wishes considered? That is not what Taken In Hand is supposed to be about, the idea is that the both people in the relationship should consider each other's feelings and wishes.

I have no desire at all to have doors opened for me, and my husband doesn't bother with this, but that isn't because he holds me in contempt, but rather because it simply isn't something he was brought up to do. What you describe as 'eading' sounds more like 'trampling' tome.

Louise

I liked this article a lot

I liked this article a lot. Not everything can be assimilated into every Taken In Hand relationship, but I found it fun to read and will certainly encourage my HOH to read it too; and hopefully he'll implement some of these things in our relationship. I think Truthful Scout really has a grasp on what many women like in a romantic relationship. I hope she writes more.

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